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The Duck Quacks Some More

The Duck Quacks Some More published on 3 Comments on The Duck Quacks Some More

Mab, Little Chicago, and Demon Reach, Aka the get out of dead free plan
by Ms DucK

Ok, let’s go back a bit:

Grave Peril:
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Here is where we first meet the winter Sidhe. And here is where it is established that Harry traded Lea his ‘life, fortune, and future’ in exchange for the power to beat Justin. (power he already had, and only needed to believe in himself, but hey.) It is also established that by breaking his word three times, his own power turns against him, his very magic now trying to force him to keep his vow. Harry later bluffs Lea (or so he believes) into an extension, but the debt- life, fortune, and future- remains in force. And then, of course, Mab buys that debt from Lea, in order to balance the scales between them. (This btw means that Harry is worth as much to Mab as the original Morgan lefay’s dagger, or fricking Excalibur) Also in this book we see Harry exit the NN near his apartment, and describe the area of his apt as a shadow version of itself. This is important later, as neither Bob or Harry remember these events in Changes. At some point soon after this book Lea builds her secret entrance into Harry’s lab; she can now enter or leave his place at will (as well as protect the NN side) since Harry’s magic and thresholds are no longer an impediment to her- since she owns them.

Summer Knight:
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Enter Mab. Cue rock and roll music, with extra rocks in. Mab demonstrates that the clause is still in full effect, by making Harry stab himself. They renegotiate; Mab allows Harry a chance to buy himself free, in return for three tasks. The limits are Harry can say No, with no reprisals; the deal remains solely between them; she cannot send lackey’s to chastise or force him by proxy. When Mab leaves, she hurts him, both out of spite and to let the reader know the original clause is still in effect- she still owns his life, future, and fortune; he only has a chance to earn his freedom. At the end she offers him the knighthood, and agrees that all debts between them will be canceled if he accepts.

Proven Guilty:
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Now here is our famous mystery. Who entered Harry’s lab, without his or Bob’s knowledge, and fixed Little Chicago? And why? Who would know about it at all?

Back In 2006 JenniH posted that she didn’t think Mab was responsible for Proven Guilty, as she would not sacrifice a main servitor. Jim replied:

Quote from: jimbutcher on January 13, 2008, 05:11:45 AM

Quote from: JenniH on June 19, 2006, 02:09:18 PM

Mab as orchestrator of all is just a little much for me to swallow. Seems like she loses a lot more than she gains, and I don’t think Mab is big on coming out behind in her negotiations.

Yeah. It sure looks that way from here, don’t it.

But to correct some minor stuff: the fetches aren’t even /close/ to her strongest servitors. They’re her couriers, harassers, spies and occasional assassins. Captain Kudzu was a being that was deemed more-or-less sufficient on the badassometer, but nothing to write home about. The fetches main use, to Mab, isn’t as battlefield thugs. She’s got /plenty/ of other things for that. Another mild correction: who says Mab /lost/ the battle at Arctis Tor, before Harry and Company arrived? At the end of the day, the Winter Queen was still in her fortress–but you didn’t see anyone standing around assaulting the place, did ya. Also, it has probably occurred to more than one of you that if Mab was /really/ in trouble, she could have had the entire military might of Faerie back at the fortress in moments–exactly the way they *did* come back when Harry smacked the Winter Well with the fires of Summer.

(Which goes to show that while Mab may be canny to an inhuman degree, she isn’t infallible. Just way closer to infallible than us.)

See above regarding “the question is *why*?”

Ask yourself why Mab had Molly brought in. What chain of events did that set in motion? What secondary effects came about because of it? Ultimately, Mab can always go to the Wyld and draw in more muscle to replace fallen thugs. If worst comes to worst, with just a few “seed” fae, she could rear up enough Changelings to repopulate her cadre within a human generation or two–nothing, to a being thousands of years old.

As far as she’s concerned, everyone and everything is expendable, including herself, when it comes to adhering to her (seemingly irrational and inexplicable) priorities.

(And by the way–don’t think Titania is much better. When push came to shove, she let her own daughter be murdered rather than upset the balance of the Faerie Courts. At least Mab is up front about it. Usually.)

Sacrifice her best troops? Mab would sacrifice every creature *in* Winter, every one she could bring from Summer, and every single mortal on planet Earth if that’s what she thought was appropriate. And she wouldn’t even need to add extra sugar to her cup of tea afterwards, much less lose sleep over it.

But no one does cold-blooded like the Queen of Winter. Mab’s been in the business a long time, she’s got a balance sheet, and she is *not* going to come out in the red–

–unless, of course, she really *has* stripped a gear, as Lily and Maeve believe. In which case there’s a stark raving bonkers demigoddess whose powers are no longer being held in check by the Escher-esque code of Sidhe behavior. And that’s all kinds of bad.

But hey. It’s probably not that. I mean, not *everything* that happens can be the absolute worst possible possibility, right?

Jim

The part about Mab being mad (with evil smiley face) was later contradicted by Jim when someone else guessed that Mab was not insane, but wounded.Note that this post confirms two things, long suspected: That Mab had Molly brought in, and that Mab and Titania worked together to kill Aurora. And he specifically addressed the chain of events that this caused. Said chain could not have occurred unless Harry and co could reach actris tor, thus for the Plan to work Mab is required to fix it; which she could easily do; just walk thru the bottom door, fix things, and tell Bob to forget it happened.

White Night

Only a small maybe cameo here: The base was built by the Sidhe (think Mab left a hidey hole?)( confirmed in TC, how Did Titania get Morgan out?) and Anastasia complains of headaches, sex drives, and a strange female voice whispering to her in her dreams.

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Stay tuned next week for more from Ms. Duck.

The Duck Quacks Again

The Duck Quacks Again published on 3 Comments on The Duck Quacks Again

Following on from last weeks Quack:


Statement: Mab knows what the future holds.

“One day, wizard, you will kneel at my feet and ask me to bestow the rank of knight upon you.”

That Mab has foresight I consider a given. Considering she cannot lie, too many of her statements are made in the future tense for it And she is not bound by the white council’s laws of magic, but only by the laws of her own nature. But the manipulations Mab makes are more than just the machinations of someone with a gift of prophecy, she is too accurate at that, and at the same time, too bound.

There is another possibility. Mab might be a time traveler. Assume someone traveled back in time, and that the laws of this world have some sort of limit on ‘paradox’; much like the classic sci fi stories such as ‘all you zombies’. The traveler would know, or remember, in some general sense what happens, but as they come closer and closer to their original moment of leaving they become more and more bound by paradox. .less and less free to take action.

This would explain much. At the start of her time travel, she would be largely free to act, but would have to become more and more circumspect in her actions as she approached the event, and frankly, after being a god for who knows how long, this would tick you off. Quite a few people have speculated bought Lea’s statement “ the doom that confronts us all” and what deal the Black Council had made with Mab to tie her hands in such a manner she had to arrange PG just to be partly free of it. The answer, if I am correct, is it does not matter. Mab had to agree to such a deal, because she remembered she had agreed to this deal.

Statement: Mab may be a time traveler.

“Well there is a whole law of magic about messing with time, and given it’s a law of magic, Dresden is going to have to break it eventually. “-JB

Well then who is she?

Well, we have some clues.

First, JB has been planning something important between Molly and Winter since before the series was even published.

Quote

“If so, that would imply that I was thinking about seven years ahead. I mean, I would have to be, to have written something like that back when I did Grave Peril, which was way before the books actually *sold*. It would mean that I’m doing a lot of stuff on purpose, given that, you know, Molly actually wound up /in/ the Winter Queen’s fortress, with Lea (Mab’s chief advisor) actually /right there/”.

“Ask yourself why Mab had Molly brought in. What chain of events did that set in motion? What secondary effects came about because of it? Ultimately, Mab can always go to the Wyld and draw in more muscle to replace fallen thugs. If worst comes to worst, with just a few “seed” fae, she could rear up enough Changelings to repopulate her cadre within a human generation or two–nothing, to a being thousands of years old. “

So let us consider secondary effects for a moment, not just In PG, but in TC. Assuming that Mab was the one who messed with LC, what did she gain? Well, it wasn’t the rescue of Thomas for one. And as to Peabody, by now I’m certain she could have just sent Harry a dang note. Or offered him power, to save Thomas he might have taken it.

What happened in TC? Harry made a pact with Demonreach, that’s what happened.

Statement: Demonreach is important to Harry’s future, and Mab intended him to have it.

Now we wander off completely into happy thought medication lands. There just isn’t enough evidence to say why Mab wants harry to be part of Demonreach. We know too little. What we do know:

The fey have an important sacrificial table, and when it formed into the real world, it formed over Lake Michigan. We have an ancient source of magical power, quite dark, on an island in.. Lake Michigan. And the island is old, damn old.

“They were not put there by Demonreach; they have been there a very long time. They are pre-Council. They’re a prehistoric script, actually. Harry could have figured out the script if he’d had the comic book. NOTE: I think this has something to do with runes on a wall in Under City seen in Welcome to the Jungle

Also, people have a few things wrong about the Gatekeeper and the island. The Gatekeeper did not hurt Demonreach. Gatekeeper has been on the island a couple of times, and it’s never gone well, but he didn’t cause Demonreach’s limp. That’s the work of the glacier that carved out Lake Michigan.”-Jb

Statement: Mab is a mortal wizard who did an ascension ritual

Quote

“If (cowl) succeeded, he’d have had the collective power of all of those supernatural beings and then some. He’d have been clearly stronger than the Ladies, and a full-on equal to Mab. I mean, why do you think the Erlking was summoned as part of that ritual? Because that’s how the big E got so boss in the first place.

For that matter, how do you think the Mothers and Queens and Ladies established their original base of power? That big old sacrificial, power-sucking stone table in Tir na noth isn’t there for its primitive decorative aesthetic.”-JB

“I am Mab. I am Sidhe”-Mab

“all the fae are a little bit mortal.”

“ Depends on how much influence he has in the world. That’s how the Sidhe gain their size and power. Mab wasn’t always as big as she is now. ”

Now there are some other facts. :

“The thing is that Mab never really figures Dresden quite right. She never gets it right when she tries to predict what he will do. But Small Favor turned out really well for her.”

Whom else do we know that is in love with Harry and could be described just the same? And not, JB said Harry will break the laws of time, not Molly. Mab herself refers to it in SF, with “Whatever your past, whatever your future..” I thought at first she meant his personal past, but what if in the past, he did something?

“ But Harry will regret every having set foot on that island. Of course, Harry regrets just about anything he’s ever done.”-JB

“Mab is one of her true names.”- JB

Margaret Katherine Amanda Carpenter.. Mab, or more properly Meab, is old English short for Margaret. And then there is her looks, and the hair ( started many colors, is now tinged with white and blue at the ends.) and how her powers are in enchantment, illusion, glamour and mental magic’s..

The Theory:

At some time in the future, Harry and Molly will be forced to experiment with time travel, quite probably involving demon reach. Harry will screw something up, and leave Molly behind, or lost in time, 100,000 years ago.. she becomes Sidhe, and ascends, to come back to him..

Mine ! Mine ! Mine !
– Nuff said.

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Edit and Update:

The idea came to me in a game we played sometime between the publishing of SmF and TC. It was then later updated for TC. Since the publication of Changes and Aftermath, I think we can add some more into it:

Why Demonreach?

Because Mab knew Harry was going to be shot. Demonreach is a source of magic; dark and dangerous magic. By the statement of the gatekeeper, it is not on a ley line, it is the well from which the line comes. Now there may be several types of dark magic, and it is true that there are four dark ley lines in Chicago. But outside of Demonreach, one we know for certain is the intersection beneath the field museum, which is a very potent source of necromancy. The magic for raising or bringing back the dead.

It is my belief that while Mab may have rid Harry like a pony for personal reasons, she broadcast it to every place and water in faerie to let her enemies know she was preparing for war. She has enemies, but is still uncertain who they all are; they are hidden from her sight. Therefore she has to lure them into the open; and then smite them.

In the end of Changes, and Aftermath, and in Ghost Story I believe that this exactly what is happening. Her enemies, believing she has lost her knight ( and hence her ability to wage war on the mortal plane) ( They killed him) and that the other powers that might stop them ( The White Council, The White Court, The Red Court) have all been placed out of play have stepped out into the open and are openly perusing their own real objectives, at last.

They don’t know that Mab has made her knight a ‘get out of death free’ card.

And there shall be smiting
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Predictions
• Harry was killed by the Black Court, or their agents. They had their people standing by to take advantage within hours of his death.(uncertain as of GS, are the fallen agents/allies/ ?)
• The Black Court, or their agents, are the enemies of Ghost Story(ditto)(Jim said after Cold Days)
• Demonreach will be involved in Harry’s return. (Correct as of GS!)
• Mab planned this in advance. (Correct as of GS!)

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Notes on Cold Days
– We now know Mab can simply walk right in to Dresden’s Lab at any time; the threshold only limits her if she means to do harm. Apparently Harry always knew this but ‘forgot’ for the last six years.. Probably because Mab wanted him too.
– Molly of course, did not become Mab in this book. She became the winter lady, Mab’s heir. But, the series is not over yet.
– It is confirmed that Mab has been preparing Molly for this, likely since Proven Guilty. Her answer, that she did so because of Harry’s faith in Molly, only makes sense if you assume some level of foreknowledge.
– We now know that Demon reach is very important to Mab, and in a purely personal sense.
– Mab does indeed have a plan about luring her enemies in
– Mab was mortal once
– The headaches may have been caused by Lash; this is implied by demon reach. But the timing is off for her to be the cause of all of them; we know for a fact Mab caused one in Small favor and the timing of the rest is still very coincidental.
– We also know Mab, Demon Reach, and lash have some sort of arrangement
– Mab at the end of Ghost Story swore not to mess with Harry’s head anymore. This is likely why Harry remembers about the Sidhe and thresholds. I predict Mab made a deal with Lash, to mess with Harry’s head for her from now on.
– It’s likely that the missing Black Court elders are in demon reach prison, explaining their interest in the place
– The existence of the mantle, and its ability to move information thru time, may be a much better explanation for the Mab/Molly relationship then time travel. It still solves the essential questions and does so more neatly; my only excuse is Jim never mentioned such a thing prior to Cold Days
– Imagine a line. Point A is Mab in the past, point B is Molly/Mab in the future. Now from each point, draw radials; this is the light cone of potential pasts and futures. At a distance, the two points can perceive each other clearly, but as they approach a unified present more and more possible lines intersect, leading to more random events and a harder time making predictions. It’s a feedback system; each foreknowledge defines and curtails future information; as its gets closer and closer to a present now, Mab’s precognition gets less and less accurate.
– Or in plane language, it will fail her when she needs it most.
– And it will be Harry’s fault

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Ms. Duck is not only a theoretician of the finest caliber, but she is also a writer. Check out some of her work!

The Duck Quacks

The Duck Quacks published on 4 Comments on The Duck Quacks

Theory 1: Molly/ Mab
Part 1

Quote
“You should not presume wizard. I adore Freedom. Anyone who doesn’t have it wants it”


WEIGHT OF EVIDENCE FOR MOLLY AND MAB

This all started with the headaches. Harry has them, we all know this. There have been a few suggestions as to why; Lash coming back, permanent brain damage at the end of WN, perhaps he has strained his magic too much, but then I realized we know at least one cause for this headaches; he has them in SF, when Mab messed with his head while she borrowed his blasting rod, and reprogrammed his head to forget he had ever had it. While discussing this, I wondered well then, if she caused that headache, what else could have happened during the books that she could have taken or messed with?

Which gives us, in discrete mathematics, our starting point?

STATEMENT: Mab caused the headaches.

I am not saying this is the truth, I am stating it as the point of argument. In discrete math, you start with an assumption, then build on it one point at a time, as a test to determine if the original point is true. (For all rational numbers N, if N is F(N) is true, then F( N+1) is true; if you then can reverse it from the final conclusion, the theory is true ; this is called the principles of incursion and reduction.)

So, following this point, what other headaches could have been caused by Mab? It was He Whom Walks who first noted that in the book Turn Coat, that little Chicago was not mentioned. Which is strange, as Harry was desperate to find Thomas; and in every other book, Harry mentions it in every other book, and it had been repaired form it’s damage taken in WN as it was used in SF. Furthermore, when Harry does refer to the table, it is covered by a heavy tarp; which are the same words he used to describe his missing memories of the blasting rods on SF, page 312. And we know Mab caused those headaches, it describes the headaches, right on that very page.

Additional point, Namshiel’s missing coin. We have been assuming That either Marcone, Hendricks, or Gard took it. But Marcones says he did not, Hendricks has shown no signs of it, and Gard was driving. But what if there were other people on the island, undetectable to mortal eyes? Mab cannot interfere directly in mortal affairs, but she can claim anything Harry owns or has rights to. His “life, his fortune, his future”; once he defeated Namshiel was defeated his coin by right of battle was Harry’s and Mab could step in and claim it. ( I will admit this one may be stretching things, but it’s just a side idea.)

STATEMENT: Mab fixed little Chicago in Proven Guilty. “even if there HAD been a threshold, it wouldn’t have done diddly to stop any number of supernatural baddies. The fetches in PG hammered down the /Carpenters’/ front door, and that’s a threshold like the rock of firkin’ Gibraltar. The loup-garou sneered at such things. A threshold wouldn’t slow down a Denarian for a moment, nor would it stop ghouls, ogres, or any number of largely physical (as opposed to manifested spiritual) beings. And even if the skinwalker had been something summoned from the Nevernever into a manifested physical body, the toad demon was one of those too, and IT stomped through Harry’s pathetic threshold in the very first book”

-Jim Butcher

Which leaves questions of how Mab got past the wards, Past Bob- something I consider a point in her favor actually; of all the suspects she could mess with Bob the easiest; and most importantly, how could she have predicted this chain of events?

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